ALL BLOG POSTS AND COMMENTS COPYRIGHT (C) 2003-2017 VOX DAY. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. REPRODUCTION WITHOUT WRITTEN PERMISSION IS EXPRESSLY PROHIBITED.

Friday, April 07, 2017

Blunder or complete debacle?

The God-Emperor pulls a Clinton and lobs 59 missiles at Syria:
The United States on Friday fired dozens of cruise missiles at a Syrian airbase from which it said a deadly chemical weapons attack was launched this week, an escalation of the U.S. military role in Syria that immediately raised tension with Russia.

Just hours after U.S. President Donald Trump announced he had ordered the attack, a spokesman for Russian President Vladimir Putin said the strike had seriously damaged ties between Washington and Moscow.

Two U.S. warships fired 59 cruise missiles from the eastern Mediterranean Sea at the Syrian airbase controlled by the forces of President Bashar al-Assad in response to a poison gas attack in a rebel-held area on Tuesday, U.S. officials said.

Putin, a staunch ally of Assad, regarded the U.S. action as "aggression against a sovereign nation" on a "made-up pretext" and a cynical attempt to distract the world from civilian deaths in Iraq, his spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, was cited as saying by agencies.

It was the toughest direct U.S. action yet in Syria's six-year-old civil war and leaves Trump facing his biggest foreign policy crisis since his Jan. 20 inauguration, raising the risk of confrontation with Russia and Iran, Assad's two main military backers.
Without question, this looks both stupid and disappointing. Following the lead of the neocons inevitably leads to disaster, sooner or later, for both the US President and the American people. And why now, when Assad and the various allied forces have ISIS on the run?

Perhaps it is because ISIS is an American creation? Perhaps because Israel prefers Daesh to Assad? Who knows?

Regardless, it's important to keep in mind that the God-Emperor always makes mistakes. He always bumbles around like a bull in a china shop in any new or complicated situation. But usually, he learns from them. Usually, when one horn of his A/B testing fails, he abandons that strategy.

The problem, of course, is that "send American troops to fight and die in the Middle East" is an obvious failure that shouldn't require any testing. And with tensions on the rise in North Korea, it seems a spectacularly stupid thing to attempt to heat up a second front, particularly at the price of losing Russian cooperation.
Furious Vladimir Putin has called the US airstrikes on Syria an 'illegal act of aggression' and suspended a deal to avoid mid-air clashes with American fighter jets over the war-torn country. The Russian President warned of grave damage to relations between Washington and Moscow which are already 'in tatters'... Syrian Army officials described the attack as an act of 'blatant aggression', saying it had made the US 'a partner' of ISIS, the ex-Nusra Front and other 'terrorist organisations'. 
So, we'll see. But we can still hope, not unreasonably, that Trump is merely giving Mattis or one of his military advisors his head, and that he will step in and make replacements once it becomes obvious that the "let's pick a fight with Iran and Russia over Syria while rattling sabres at North Korea and China" is not a viable grand strategy. Never forget, Trump is a delegator, and this would appear to have been Mattis's call.
The Pentagon's plan, delivered by Defense Secretary (and former Central Command commander) James Mattis, at Wednesday's NSC meeting: a hellfire of Tomahawk missiles on the airfield where Assad's regime had launched the attack. If there was dissent among any on Trump's national security team, nobody spoke up. "Everybody agreed that this was the option that they liked," said an administration official with knowledge of the meeting.

So on Thursday morning, a number of national security officials went to work at the White House believing the strike was imminent. But only a small number of principals—President Trump, Mattis, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, and national security advisor H.R. McMaster among them—had knowledge the strike would happen Thursday night.
I'm not giving up on the God-Emperor yet. It is the mark of a good leader to permit his subordinates to make decisions, to act upon those decisions, and then hold them accountable for the subsequent consequences. But this is a very good reminder that he wasn't ever anything more than a long shot. And, it must be said, at least we're not already at war with Russia over Ukraine, as would have almost certainly been the case had Hillary or one of the other Republicans been elected. In any event, Trump is going to have to learn to stop reacting like an emotionally incontinent woman trained by Pavlov whenever he sees children on television. He was elected to build a wall, send them back, and keep Americans out of war, not play Middle East kingmaker.

We don't know yet that this is a complete debacle. But does appear to be, at minimum, a blunder, though possibly a necessary one. Trump will learn, as all U.S. Presidents eventually do, that foreign policy is a lot harder than domestic policy. War is a very serious business; would that U.S. politicians and generals would learn to treat it that way.


UPDATE: Or neither? After further discussion offline, I believe one of two scenarios are in play. One is the obvious "give the neocons their head" scenario I mentioned. The other is a much bigger one which I will not discuss in public, but would be very surprising and significant indeed. I've already written it out for the record; if events proceed accordingly, I'll post it after the fact.

In the meantime, I would suggest trusting the God-Emperor until there is considerably more evidence that he is actually going to send ground troops to Syria to fight Syrian, Iranian, and Russian troops there. There is almost certainly much more going on here than meets the mainstream media's eye.

Labels:

304 Comments:

1 – 200 of 304 Newer› Newest»
Blogger Farnarkel of OZ April 07, 2017 4:35 AM  

I sense that this could be a swift kick in the posterior for the Syrians and no follow up until they play silly buggers again. If President Trump sits back with very little commentary, and no indication as to follow ups, life will become very uncertain for some players in MENA

Anonymous Conker April 07, 2017 4:37 AM  

The reaction from the right has been brutal. One tweet in particular, and I'm paraphrasing: "Trump just launched cruise missiles and destroyed his own electoral base."

Blogger FUCK GOOGLE April 07, 2017 4:44 AM  

I'm not so sure this is a blunder yet. If he follows it up with more actions and pursues more intervention, then it definitely is.

If this salvo is the extent of the action, then it may just be reminding people that Trump is not Obama - Obama would have never been this decisive. If Obama had ordered a response, it would have come weeks later and just been another drone strike.

Hoping that this is just more strategy - it also makes it seem that stories about Trump being Putin's man that much more ridiculous.

Blogger Sherwood family April 07, 2017 4:44 AM  

My concern is that if Bannon is really out there is no one left to draw Trump's attention to the reaction of the Alt-Right to this and Trump may take the popular support he is feeling from the MSM and run with it. Kushner, who appears to be the reason that Bannon was pushed out, is not going to do point this out to the God Emperor.

I will hope this is a one off blunder and Trump figures out that this was a bad move. Time will tell.

The only silver lining is that much of the Alt-Right was chastising the White House for this and did not act like stupid partisan Trump cheerleaders people seem to take them for. That is a relief at least.

Anonymous MIG April 07, 2017 4:48 AM  

Netanyahu praised Trump for doing this: "President Trump sent a strong and clear message today that the use and spread of chemical weapons will not be tolerated. Israel fully supports President Trump’s decision..."

Why? I don't understand it. What is Israel's benefit in this?

Blogger Antony April 07, 2017 4:49 AM  

An interesting take on Kushner by the Irish Savant in "Hope Dies" ; http://irishsavant.blogspot.co.uk/2017/04/hope-dies.html

Blogger James Jones April 07, 2017 4:49 AM  

This is bad news. This shows Trump to be monumentally inconsistent. He tweeted Obama not to get involved over chemical weapons in 2013, saying that the US had everything to lose and nothing to gain.

Now he releases a cretinous statement about it being in US interests to deter the use of chemical weapons.

So disappointed right now.

Anonymous Andrew (been around for a while) April 07, 2017 4:50 AM  

I think Scott Adams' take on this is pretty good. It's easy to see this as a blunder and be disappointed (also my first response), but launching a few missiles at an airbase is far from a major engagement. And it works for Trump in multiple ways on the PR front.

Anonymous MIG April 07, 2017 4:51 AM  

@3 "it also makes it seem that stories about Trump being Putin's man that much more ridiculous."

It's not a good enough reason, in my opinion.

Blogger Markku April 07, 2017 4:52 AM  

All Russian news sources are reporting that six soldiers have been killed (was previously seven - perhaps one was thought dead but was merely badly wounded) and about the same amount were wounded. Also an unknown number of civilians were killed. So it's not just launching a few missiles.

Blogger Jonathan Wales April 07, 2017 4:54 AM  

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/news/oil-prices-jump-after-us-launches-missile-strike-in-syria/ar-BBzveES?li=AA54rU&ocid=edgsp

Anonymous LurkingPuppy April 07, 2017 4:56 AM  

From http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4388780/Doctor-Syria-stood-trial-terror-offences.html ( https://archive.is/1omOY ), emphasis added:An AFP journalist in Khan Sheikhun saw a young girl, a woman and two elderly people dead at a hospital, with foam still visible around their mouths.

Doctors at the facility were using basic equipment, some not even wearing lab coats, and attempting to revive patients who were not breathing.

A father carried his dead little girl, her lips blueish and her dark curls visible, wrapped in a blue sheet.

As doctors worked, a warplane circled overhead, striking first near the facility and then hitting it twice, bringing rubble down on medics and patients.

In a video posted online by Idlib's local medical directorate, a doctor described patient symptoms as he treated a child.

'We are seeing unconsciousness, convulsions, pinpoint pupils, severe foaming, and lack of oxygen,' he said.

Based on the paragraph that I bolded, (a) the Syrian aircraft were using unguided munitions and needed to adjust their aim during the attack, (b) the Syrian aircraft were dropping conventional munitions during that attack, and (c) the Syrian aircraft were targeting a known hospital.

(c) is a war crime in itself, so there would be no further downside to using gas to attack the hospital itself. In fact, given (a), the Syrians would have been better off using gas against the hospital, as it would have killed the witnesses to the war crimes they committed during that attack far more reliably. So why (b), in an attack in which they had allegedly already used gas?

That attack doesn't make sense, even if Assad had a reason to pick that moment to use chemical weapons.

Blogger Markku April 07, 2017 4:56 AM  

Latest from Pravda.ru, via Google Translate:

"Pravda.Ru" asked for comment to the Council of Federation Committee Chairman of the Defense and Security Viktor Ozerov:

- Due to the impact on the Syrian base of our cooperation with the United States may be interrupted. This we regard as an act of aggression, and otherwise everything that happened here on you can not see. 59 bombs fell on the airfield Shayrat. Here all the words about the use of force in Syria said Trump, and then refute them were throwing some, lose all meaning. It is done. I do not really understand what game they're playing. But we will respond to it.

Anonymous Rien April 07, 2017 4:57 AM  

IMO he has just demonstrated that peaceful political change is impossible. We already know that violent change is impossible.
So what exactly are we left with?

Blogger Nara April 07, 2017 4:58 AM  

When Israel, Turkey and a who's who of neo-con warhawks are praising the strikes you know Trump's messed up.

Blogger Shimshon April 07, 2017 5:01 AM  

I'm at a loss to understand this decision. Is Trump so easily swayed by a few images (regardless of how grisly)? The credulity is a little bit shocking. Given the recent favorable turn towards Assad by Tillerman, and favorable developments for Assad in general, it doesn't even make sense.

Blunders like this (assuming it's a blunder) can quickly get out of control.

Sadly the opposition takes a very opportunistic anti-war stance, so whatever they say is devoid of any content.

Blogger Unknown April 07, 2017 5:04 AM  

This might actually work for Trump as far as a negotiating ploy, but I'm still bummed about this. I hope there's something he knows that we don't.

Blogger exfarmkid April 07, 2017 5:10 AM  

Reuters calls this "Trump's first foreign policy crisis".

This "crisis" is of his own making and very much contradicts the "America First" platform he ran on.

Blogger Double E April 07, 2017 5:10 AM  

I don't know if I can buy the "for the children" reasoning for Trump's motivation. Just as many sad pictures were passed around before when he said (correctly) that Obama would be an idiot for getting involved. Why would he so easily see past the propaganda then and be so wholly taken by it now?

The idea that it was good because now people will believe Russia and Trump aren't buddies is also stupid. He shouldn't betray his most loyal supporters and risk WWIII to supposedly convince his opponents (who will never support him) that he really isn't working with Russia.

As far as the idea that this is just a 'one-off' action and won't lead to anything else - yeah right, what is this? A military foreign policy version of "just the tip"?

None of it makes any sense. Very disappointing.

Blogger VD April 07, 2017 5:11 AM  

This is bad news. This shows Trump to be monumentally inconsistent.

It is not news of any kind that Trump is inconsistent. It's practically his motif.

So disappointed right now.

It's too soon to reach any conclusion, unless you're a cuck. In which case, cuck away, you know you want to.

I'm at a loss to understand this decision. Is Trump so easily swayed by a few images (regardless of how grisly)? The credulity is a little bit shocking. Given the recent favorable turn towards Assad by Tillerman, and favorable developments for Assad in general, it doesn't even make sense.

As I said, he delegates decision-making to subject matter experts. Mattis and the entire National Security Council all wanted to launch cruise missiles. So, he let them do it, no doubt believing it to be a warning to Assad not to use chemical weapons again.

We don't know yet what the truth is or what will happen. I would not be surprised if heads eventually roll at the NSC if it is determined that there was no chemical weapons attack and the consequences of the airfield attack prove to be negative.

Blogger JP April 07, 2017 5:12 AM  

MIG wrote:Netanyahu praised Trump for doing this: "President Trump sent a strong and clear message today that the use and spread of chemical weapons will not be tolerated. Israel fully supports President Trump’s decision..."

Why? I don't understand it. What is Israel's benefit in this?


White people killing each other

Blogger VD April 07, 2017 5:13 AM  

Why would he so easily see past the propaganda then and be so wholly taken by it now?

Because he's not paying attention to the media propaganda. He's listening to his trusted military advisors and the Pentagon.

He hasn't learned yet that they can't be trusted either. But I suspect he's about to do so.

None of it makes any sense.

Of course it does. There are pro-war forces inside the Cabinet and they finally managed to get Trump to sign off on something. That does not mean they are in charge.

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 5:14 AM  

I don't think this was a mistake.

Either Syria did it, and thus Trump has proved he's not Russia's bitch while avoiding a broad escalation by limiting it to the offending airbase,

or Syria didn't do it, and Trump can discredit the Neo-Cons and the Deep State, and fire some people for being maliciously gullible.

The videos of children gasping like fish were rhetorical gasoline which Trump has now expended in a controlled burn, simultaneously silencing the Left's main attack against him.

Had he not, those images would've haunted Trump's efforts at anti-Communist counter-coup. We live in a bitch universal suffrage democracy - that is the current reality.

Just as Vietnam was a war between State Department and Pentagon, so this moment was part of a media war of Putin, Trump, Assad and Alt-Right vs USSA Deep State, neo-cons and Commies.

I say aim fire at the evil advisers and institutions, not the newly-coronated king.

Blogger Markku April 07, 2017 5:16 AM  

Had he not, those images would've haunted Trump's efforts at anti-Communist counter-coup.

That's about at the bottom of my concerns. My main concern is that Pravda is talking about USA having started World War 3. I know what THAT means.

Blogger Shimshon April 07, 2017 5:19 AM  

"As I said, he delegates decision-making to subject matter experts. Mattis and the entire National Security Council all wanted to launch cruise missiles. So, he let them do it, no doubt believing it to be a warning to Assad not to use chemical weapons again."

Vox, I understand the reasoning. But when you know intelligence failed vis a vis Iraqi WMDs (among many other failures), it seems odd to delegate based on their expertise. He seemed to take personal umbrage at the attack.

Otherwise, my reaction would be less restrained were it anyone else. Perhaps we will see some heads roll. He is more likely to call his subordinates on their errors than not.

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 5:21 AM  

> My main concern is that Pravda is talking about USA having started World War 3.

You think the train stops on a dime? Nuclear WWIII was socionomically INEVITABLE without the Internet. If the only further casualties are the 7 dudes on that airbase, let's build each one of them statues.

Trump is not in charge yet.

Blogger Shimshon April 07, 2017 5:23 AM  

"Of course it does. There are pro-war forces inside the Cabinet and they finally managed to get Trump to sign off on something. That does not mean they are in charge."

This does make sense. Just because Trump assented to their proposed response does not make them in charge. The response itself indicates a lack of full faith in the assertion of Assad's culpability. If he were truly guilty, first, Russia would not be standing by him, and second, the response would likely have been something closer to toppling him. Maybe those cruise missiles were close to their expiration date.

Anonymous Walter Oleg April 07, 2017 5:24 AM  

We can hope that Trump knows that the attack was not carried out by Assad and that this information will come out later, which will allow him to fire his neo-con advisers. We can hope.

Anonymous LurkingPuppy April 07, 2017 5:28 AM  

Shimshon wrote:Sadly the opposition takes a very opportunistic anti-war stance, so whatever they say is devoid of any content.
Shepard Smith (the head of Fox News Channel's fake news division, and a blatant commie NeverTrumper) pounded the war drums all day, right up to the moment they announced that Trump had pissed away some Tomahawks. Then he immediately switched to being anti-war and bashing Trump for launching an air strike after he had tweeted in 2013 that Obama shouldn't go to war in Syria. At least they're not hiding their fakeness as well lately.

Shimshon wrote:But when you know intelligence failed vis a vis Iraqi WMDs (among many other failures), it seems odd to delegate based on their expertise. He seemed to take personal umbrage at the attack.
According to one of the talking heads on the TV fake news, he did take personal umbrage, but at the fact that the Russians wouldn't admit that the Syrian government used chemical weapons. The U.S.'s fake intelligence agencies must have really convinced Trump that Assad was using gas. (I won't believe it unless they release some very definitive raw intelligence.)

Walter Oleg wrote:We can hope that Trump knows that the attack was not carried out by Assad and that this information will come out later, which will allow him to fire his neo-con advisers. We can hope.
I sure wouldn't hope that Trump would be willing to kill innocent people for political reasons.

Lying is evil. If Trump lied, then Trump is evil.

Blogger Double E April 07, 2017 5:32 AM  

Of course it does. There are pro-war forces inside the Cabinet and they finally managed to get Trump to sign off on something. That does not mean they are in charge

Oh for sure, I have no doubt that is the case. I was just wondering what line of reasoning they used to convince him this was the best course of action.

What didn't make sense to me is either of the 2 most common explanations I have seen all over the internet so far:

1. He has a soft spot for kids and they used sad pictures to sway him.
2. they convinced him he had to not look weak and/or prove that he isn't a Russian puppet.

Either just seems way to shallow and myopic for him to have been suckered by, but who knows.

Blogger Ron April 07, 2017 5:32 AM  

it seems a spectacularly stupid thing to attempt to heat up a second front

Alternatively it is not stupid, but smart, only we don't see it. Either because

a) we don't know everything that's going on behind the scenes
b) we've made assumptions about the intentions of the players that are not accurate.

Trump does not strike me as "particularly stupid" or even "remotely stupid".

Therefore either this is

a) a good idea
b) part of a longer game
c) malicious

(a) and (b) assume Pres Trump is a positive force, (c) assumes he is a negative one.

Anonymous Saracen III April 07, 2017 5:32 AM  

This is a colossal blunder, and Trump was set up.
Deep State don't have sexual compromise on DT but a roll-your-own War Crime will do nicely.
It also makes a nice distraction from PizzaGate

Consider,
Ten cruise missiles make a nice punitive strike. Times two for destructive certainty.
That leaves ~30 to go astray and mash up bystanders. Show the graphic results to Trump but keep it quiet in the media.
Put on the stoic Face of Concern but keep Trump isolated from real people and in battle shock
Until. It all.Comes. Out. DT can then be accurately deemed imcompetent. And impeachable.

Indicators.
No satellite footage. No BDA.
No decent footage of the gas attack either.

DT isn't out of the game, be he is on the ropes.
The times maketh the man. I hope.

Anonymous DaveP. April 07, 2017 5:33 AM  

In order for a deterrence to be effective, it has to be credible. I'm all in favor of tossing a bunch of Tomahawks at Syrians if that's the price of making sure the next batch of goobers believe that we'll go after them too. As long as DJT doesn't start talking about 'peacekeeping forces' or 'rebuilding', it's all good. Besides, shelling stroppy Muslims from the sea has been an American tradition ever since we had a Navy; only the delivery method has changed.

Anonymous LurkingPuppy April 07, 2017 5:41 AM  

Double E wrote:1. He has a soft spot for kids and they used sad pictures to sway him.
1b. He has a soft spot for (((Ivanka))), and she brought him the video of dead kids and cried about it.

And told him that Assad is the meanie who used the gas, of course.

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 5:42 AM  

Now we need Assad to win the ground war, making the Left look like unfashionable evil losers, and Putin to punch back twice as hard and with moral authority, leading Americans to vent their fear and fury on internal traitors.

I can't wait for Putin's next humble brilliant humiliation of the USSA. Guess those Russians have learned how to handle empireSS.

Blogger Elocutioner April 07, 2017 5:44 AM  

Perhaps responding to the chemical weapons hoax was merely a pretext for something else that Assad or Putin were up to? The strike made headlines but as far as we know all it accomplished militarily was a destroyed airbase.

Besides appeasing the "do it for someone else's children!" cucks maybe he's trying to sort out the sources of the bad intel and analysis? (Seriously, the papers were quoting the White Helmets on the scene and actually calling them 'White Helmets.')

Trump dined with the Chinese President at Mar-A-Lago while the strikes happened. That's not a coincidence. And this confirms for Putin that Trump isn't indecisive with washable red lines. All in all from a diplomacy POV a few cruise missiles is a cheap(ish) way to send messages.

I think it had multiple angles to it and yet again Trump will navigate new waters masterfully. I'm hopeful.

Blogger Lovekraft April 07, 2017 5:45 AM  

If you think of the world as an arena in which competing gangsters jockey for power, this is part of a never-ending cycle and one in which me must position ourselves accordingly.

Remember, to a Marxist the Venezuelan horrors are just part of the 'march towards progress' (by the way, has anyone heard from Chavez's old buddy Sean Penn lately?).

Positioning to defend against the rabidly violent and scurrilous enemies. The regressives don't need an excuse to hate us, but this may provide them with moral cover.

Let's be cautious and monitor the situation. By next week there should be a clear path.

Anonymous map April 07, 2017 5:48 AM  

This is troubling but, really, what could Trump do? The lead-in was imagery of children being hit with Sarin gas.

America is an effeminate culture. There is a limit to how many alt-right messages Trump can project.

1) Callous indifference to this gets played negatively.

2) A wait-and-see investigation makes him look weak and callous. Besides, what investigation would lead to any other conclusion but Syria using Sarin gas? The media is not on his side. Time will not remove this from the new cycle.

3) He is in no position to accuse the Deep State of a false flag event. He can't claim that no Syrians were killed by Sarin, or the attacks never happened, or some other entity is responsible. Sure, we can argue that ISIS is controlled by CIA, or at least tacitly supported, but Trump can't do that.

Bombing that base was, really, the only reasonable course of action to take, given the circumstances.

Anonymous Esmar Tuek April 07, 2017 5:51 AM  

Assad using chemical weapons is akin to me donning a sandwich board, with a picture of mohamhead on it, and marching into Bury Park, Luton, UK. I'd be committing suicide.

I've never understood why chemical weapons are bad, but burning people alive, blowing them up...fine. Nonsensical. The only rules in war are those imposed by the more powerful.

Anonymous W. Lindsay Wheeler April 07, 2017 5:54 AM  

Screw Trump. I was a diehard voter from the beginning. NOT Anymore.

To hell with Trump.

This shows the Masonic control of America; America is the world's policeman and our military is infected with the Masonic disease. I'm not voting for Trump the next time. Screw him. I have more respect for Assad and Putin. Putin isn't a Globalist, Trump is. To hell with Trump and our Military Masonic gobbledygook.

Ohh, and this happened within two months of his inauguration---sounds like a planned CIA op. Screw you. The CIA/Soros groups were instigating rebellion in Syria. We started the rebellion in Syria. Screw Masonic America, Screw Trump.

Blogger Double E April 07, 2017 5:55 AM  

Bombing that base was, really, the only reasonable course of action to take, given the circumstances.

I disagree. what has been accomplished here, other than supposedly avoiding this so called "negative play" in the media? A media that was all anti-trump all the time anyway.

It's not like he's gonna get all these cucks and never-trumpers on his side just because they are giddy right now.



Anonymous Esmar Tuek April 07, 2017 6:02 AM  

W. Lindsay Wheeler wrote:Screw Trump. I was a diehard voter from the beginning. NOT Anymore.

To hell with Trump.

This shows the Masonic control of America; America is the world's policeman and our military is infected with the Masonic disease. I'm not voting for Trump the next time. Screw him. I have more respect for Assad and Putin. Putin isn't a Globalist, Trump is. To hell with Trump and our Military Masonic gobbledygook.

Ohh, and this happened within two months of his inauguration---sounds like a planned CIA op. Screw you. The CIA/Soros groups were instigating rebellion in Syria. We started the rebellion in Syria. Screw Masonic America, Screw Trump.


People all over the place are experiencing this emotion. You can't expect some guy on a white horse to make everything better.

You will be getting called a concern troll or a cuck i expect, but the threat of being called that isn't going to stem the concern.

The movement is stronger than Trump.

Anonymous map April 07, 2017 6:07 AM  

Double E,

"I disagree. what has been accomplished here, other than supposedly avoiding this so called "negative play" in the media? A media that was all anti-trump all the time anyway."

It's not a matter of convincing the media. It's a matter of short-circuiting a meme among the low information voters. Letting this go would mean image after image of dead Syrian children on an endless loop. The base that was supposedly used to launch this attack was destroyed, which is as proportional and as measured a response you can get.

Do I think this is a deep-state false flag attack? Of course, but Trump is in no position to make that claim or act on that assumption.

Guys, he's not going to win every chess match.

Blogger Double E April 07, 2017 6:09 AM  

To hell with Trump.

Even if this turns out to be as bad a mistake as it appears it could be, it is no reason to abandon Trump completely. He has shown the ability to be agile and learn from his mistakes.

We could have Hillary putting a SCOTUS justice in right now. Illegal immigration is already slowing down dramatically. Obamacare is getting dealt with, at least partially so far. The wall will probably actually get built.

I think Trump is making a large mistake hear, but I do think it is just a mistake. All is not lost.

Blogger Balázs Varga April 07, 2017 6:09 AM  

This seems like a very serious blunder. The Russians are upset and the only silver lining is that they were warned beforehand so hopefully managed to get their personnel out.

But hey, Hillary would have done this months ago. At worst, we still gained months of time.

Blogger Elocutioner April 07, 2017 6:10 AM  

@40 Double E - Pick battles you can win. He's neutralized this fakenews issue - he acted just as they demanded.

Also, he sends Nikki Haley to the UN to draw up a resolution on Assad that Russia vetoes which makes it easier to publicly diminish the UN as useless and archaic.

Blogger ZhukovG April 07, 2017 6:15 AM  

I would like to point out that if we only killed 7 people with almost 60 Tomahawks, then the strike was likely just a demonstration and was intended to kill no one. While I am personally disappointed with this action I am not ready to give up on the GE. There is too much going on behind the scenes that we don't know.

Also I think some overestimate Ivanka's influence.



Blogger JaimeInTexas April 07, 2017 6:17 AM  

Trump is the POTUS. Anything already in works at his swearing not his doing. This is a total fuck up. The ramificatiobs are all on the downside.
Trump fucked up. It is a total acceptance of the "Assad gassed his people" narrative put out by the White Helmets.
Trump now galls into the category of other POTUS: deserve to be impeached and removed.
Will not happen.
I expect no real difference from here on out.

Blogger Double E April 07, 2017 6:19 AM  

Letting this go would mean image after image of dead Syrian children on an endless loop.

They tried the exact same thing with drowned kids and the refugee crisis and he powered through. He could do the same here.

Anonymous Darth Dharmakīrti April 07, 2017 6:20 AM  

Besides, shelling stroppy Muslims from the sea has been an American tradition ever since we had a Navy; only the delivery method has changed.

nearly spat out my coffee, well done

Anonymous Bellator Mortalis April 07, 2017 6:21 AM  

Blunder or complete debacle?

Neither. You all are missing the frame.
(1) Trump cries "boo hoo the little baybeeessss". (The excuse).
(2) USA lobs 3 score Tomahawks (1000 pound warheads) at a Syrian airbase -- after warning the Russians, who told the Syrians. Thus human casualties were low.
(3) Airbase totally destroyed.
(4) Trump then goes and has dinner with the Chinese president.
(5) A key topic of the USA/China discussion is how to deal with "fat boy" North Korean leader and his nuke missile goals.

Message successfully sent.

Get it?

Blogger VD April 07, 2017 6:21 AM  

This is a total fuck up. The ramificatiobs are all on the downside.

No, not necessarily. As I posted in an update, there is a POTENTIAL explanation that will have you all singing the God-Emperor's praises again. I'm not going to explain it now, but I promise I will explain it later if it proves to be right or wrong.

Just sit tight for now. I suspect there is a lot more going on here than we can presently see.

Blogger Achilles April 07, 2017 6:21 AM  

Trump warned the Russians of the strike. And the Russians obviously warned the Syrians. There is the dwindling chance this was just to appease the warmonger neocon Senators so they will vote for Gorsuch. Even with the nuclear option it will be close.

This is looking more like Trump has been swayed by pictures of dead babies and the Kushners however. It's major blunder I'm not sure he can recover from. He campaigned against playing world police. He tweeted against bombing Syria. His base is against this. It creates cover for more "refugees". It risks world war if Russians get harmed. And frankly, nobody gives a shit about Syrians getting gassed. Certainly not the guy lobbing 60 Tomahawk missiles at Syrians.

The only path for Trump to recover is to build the wall, cut taxes, repeal obamacare, and fix trade. They have to be accomplished soon. They have to work. If the bombings stop and Trump fulfills his campaign promises this can be corrected. But boots on the ground in Syria will make his blunder irreversible.

Blogger ZhukovG April 07, 2017 6:30 AM  

@Vox and Double E: Exactly right, people wearing sackcloth and ashes while bemoaning their decision to vote for the GE back in November seem to be forgetting how much worse it could be.

If Hillary had won we would likely have been at war with Russia already. Back when conventional wisdom was that Hillary would win, there were indications that Russia was preparing a preemptive strike, probably against Ukraine.

Additionally, Donald Trump is not going to save America. The big wins for America from the last election were:

1. The emergence of the Alt-Right as a viable and growing political movement.

2. The awakening of a national identity within White Americans.

These are the breakthroughs we need to exploit in our war against the Globalists. If the GE manages to do some good along the way then that is icing on the cake.

Blogger Jew613 April 07, 2017 6:31 AM  

MIG, Bibi got behind this because Bibi's entire foreign policy is based on trying, and failing, to get the support of the nations of the world. So Netanyahu will try to get behind whatever is popular among the worldwide elite at the moment whenever he can. It never works and Bibi never learns.

As for his Majesty, while this seems like a major error so many times it seemed President Trump had shot himself in the foot but he was actually setting up future success.

Blogger Samuel Nock April 07, 2017 6:33 AM  

At the risk of going all 4D Chess Master Persuader Wizardy on this, I will say that the move has potential long-term benefit to Trump and the movement:

-- Little real damage to Syrian civilians
-- Gets the Elite, Media, Cucks, NeverTrumpers and Dems off his back on domestic policy
-- Kills the "Russian owns Trump" narrative (and hopefully, Trump pre-cleared this bit of Kabuki theater with Putin first)
-- Shows China / North Korea / etc that Trump is unpredictable and dangerous: America First doesn't mean pacifism.
-- Suss out the true loyalists among his inner circle.

I still feel I owe Trump a lot more loyalty than can be killed by one action that (apparently) goes against why I voted for him.

That said, please Build the Fucking Wall.

Anonymous One Deplorable DT April 07, 2017 6:35 AM  

The cool, logical part of my brain agrees with Cernovich (support Trump but condemn this action and the neocons who pushed him to it) and Vox (wait and see what happens).

But my instinct says this is a complete debacle which will probably backfire on Trump hard in the coming days. And unlike some of the others here, I think the explanation might be as simple as Ivanka crying while showing Trump pictures of dead children.

Is it really too much to ask for a US president who keeps the US out of ME wars for 8 years?

Blogger Double E April 07, 2017 6:35 AM  

As I posted in an update, there is a POTENTIAL explanation that will have you all singing the God-Emperor's praises again.

I will admit, the last time I thought the GE was about to blunder we were gifted with this holy relic:

http://i2.cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/161129212927-trump-romney-exlarge-169.jpg

Anonymous Icicle April 07, 2017 6:35 AM  

*eats popcorn*

Anonymous Überdeplorable Psychedelic Cat Grass April 07, 2017 6:38 AM  

"In any event, Trump is going to have to learn to stop reacting like an emotionally incontinent woman trained by Pavlov whenever he sees children on television. He was elected to build a wall, send them back, and keep Americans out of war, not play Middle East kingmaker."

Exactly.

I personally don't agree with the strike, think it was foolish due to it most likely having been a false flag, and especially since the MOU between us & Russia is gone.

Having said that, this is all open source. There's gotta be stuff on the class side we don't know about. Oh to be a fly on the E Ring or in the West Wing...

Blogger peter blandings April 07, 2017 6:38 AM  

as i theorized months ago on this blog and others, trump and his family have been under threat since at least the GOP convention. the key being melania's speech, which was no mistake, but rather a warning to trump. within days of the appointment, i stated that the faggot mattis constituted a red flag the size of two football fields, for which i was schooled that the spartans and greeks were somewhat genderly ambiguous.

the simple fact is that trump is not in charge and has not been for a single minute since the inauguration. he is a hostage. the CIA is running everything. this act in syria is a colossal fuck up that trump would not have done on his own. we have agreed, have we not, that he is not a dumb guy? so why do something like this that completely poisons the lake? there is no reconciliation with russia now. mattis was a plant, pence was a plant, nikki haley (hindu cunt with a nose job and skin lightner) was a plant.

there is no learning from a fatal mistake. one lesson, one test. pass or die. two weeks ago i said here that trump needed help right away. now it's too late. people can try to justify this all they want, they can spin it, they can imagine there is some sort of arcane logic to it, they can be hopeful that trump will emerge triumphant. good luck. there is only one path for trump now: get his entire family onto his own plane and fly to moscow and beg for putin's protection. putin is the last man standing in the ruins of western civ.

Blogger IrishFarmer April 07, 2017 6:42 AM  

Ill be looking forward to your explanation because im pretty demoralized rigght now.

Anonymous One Deplorable DT April 07, 2017 6:43 AM  

In the meantime, I would suggest trusting the God-Emperor until there is considerably more evidence that he is actually going to send ground troops to Syria to fight Syrian, Iranian, and Russian troops there. There is almost certainly much more going on here than meets the mainstream media's eye.

I sincerely hope you're right. In any case, I'm not about to join an anti-Trump demonstration some where. He has my support and my prayers.

But I still feel like this is a kick to the nuts.

Blogger Deplorable April 07, 2017 6:45 AM  

In the meantime, I would suggest trusting the God-Emperor until there is considerably more evidence that he is going to send ground troops to Syria to fight Syrian, Iranian, and Russian troops there.

During the presidential campaign, sometime early last year, there came a point when I stopped criticizing his every "blunder". The outcomes always exceeded my expectations. Clearly, he was operating on a different level but towards the same goal. It's reasonable to extend that faith into his Presidency.

Until we see otherwise ("ground troops..."), let's take note of who is hopping off (and on) the train so early in the game.

Anonymous karsten April 07, 2017 6:45 AM  

So maybe Trump was a Hillary plant after all?

I'm only half-kidding. I mean, what happened yesterday is exactly what she wanted, so what's the material difference?

- - - -

Looking, I'm not a cuck. Or say that I am; I don't care. But Wheeler's reaction is basically my own.

Delegation? If this is a matter of delegating, then delegation is the problem. Trump delegates to people who act against Trump's own stated intentions. And his stated intentions were the sole reason for supporting him.

He delegates health care to Ryan, and Ryan, no surprise, produces a GOPe-type bill that his base hates.

He delegates military matters to neocon generals, and, no surprise, they react with Israel-first warmongering that his base hates.

He delegates to his DHS guy, and, no surprise, DACA is still in place, and the wall (if it even does get built), now apparently won't even be a coast-to-coast structure.

Sure, Sessions is doing some good. But that's just one department. The exception to the rule.

It is no mollification to think that this disaster is due to Trump's delegates rather than to Trump himself, when Trump is the one choosing these people to delegate to. One still ends up being betrayed; indirectly by delegates rather than directly by Trump, it amounts to the same, in practice.

At the point, the 4D-chess, or 4GW, or whatever arguments are ringing hollow, when the results have the neocon seal of approval.

Sure, voting for Trump was the logical choice, per the "At least with him there's a chance for nationalist populism; with the others, there was no chance of it at all" idea.

But Trump is now careering towards a GeorgeWBush-type administration, and that's just disgusting.

Anonymous Sensei April 07, 2017 6:47 AM  

Trump is no Kasparov, but this isn't Chess; it's Go and Trump just started putting down pieces on the board he inherited. To call the match after each individual move is not only utterly futile but betrays a basic misunderstanding of what the victory conditions even are.

Blogger ZhukovG April 07, 2017 6:50 AM  

@peter blandings and others who are freaking out: I think you are overreacting. No President is completely free. Even in the days of divine right monarchy; the monarch wasn't completely free and had to keep the support of his major nobles.

If this was a planned response coordinated with Putin and Assad, intended to preempt a dangerous political situation, it would barely rise to the level of beginning 2D chess.

Thus far Putin and Assad have responded exactly as I thought they would if they were in on it. The extent to which that is true or not only time will tell.

Blogger VD April 07, 2017 6:53 AM  

there is no learning from a fatal mistake. one lesson, one test. pass or die. two weeks ago i said here that trump needed help right away. now it's too late.

Put on your big girl pants. You have ABSOLUTELY no idea what is actually going on. FFS, at least half the "cruise missiles" were dummies anyhow.

Anonymous karsten April 07, 2017 6:53 AM  

And no, I'm not about to join any anti-Trump protests; those people are still worse.

But I now feel about him basically as I do about National Review and JEB and Paul Ryan and their ilk: loathing.

Trump has turned into controlled opposition, even if unwittingly, whereas those GOPe organs are controlled opposition wittingly; but as a practical matter, the results they yield are no different.

If Trump wants his nationalist-populist base back, then he has to start acting like a nationalist populist.

Trump is not some Semitic desert-god who is to be believed in on "faith," regardless of how repellent his actions are.

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 6:54 AM  

My guess for Door #2:

Deep State root canal!

Blogger Timmy3 April 07, 2017 6:55 AM  

Let's not panic until we know more about the situation. Funny how I was panicking over the Russia collusion scandal, then the Healthcare debacle, and Gorsuch nomination. Too many plates spinning. In the end, Trump will deal with them and we are mere spectators. The only common theme is we don't know what he will do. I already thought Trump was out of character with the healthcare campaign. Pushing Ryan's plan was a mistake. The Syria situation seems to finally get the Left on his side.

Blogger Dire Badger April 07, 2017 6:55 AM  

I get a feeling that once the ramifications come out, This will put egg on the faces of every one of those 'Trump doesn't understand foreign policy' dorks.

How long does he have to play 3D chess before people figure out he isn't playing Candy land like they are?

Anonymous LurkingPuppy April 07, 2017 6:58 AM  

VD wrote:FFS, at least half the "cruise missiles" were dummies anyhow.
Do you have a public source for that? The warhead is not the expensive part of a (non-nuclear) cruise missile.

Blogger YIH April 07, 2017 6:58 AM  

I'm going with blunder as well. Though it's quite possible that this could escalate to debacle.
Hearing all this ''but, but, it's really a super-duper double secret twist strategy!'' reminded me all too much of the 2nd Bush (mis)administration where even his (frequent) verbal gaffes ''are actually proof of his genius!''.
As Bill Clinton once said: ''sometimes a cigar is just a cigar''.
Perhaps because Israel prefers Daesh to Assad?
That's the way I'm betting. I suspect that's where that sarin actually came from - and remember, they don't have nukes either. (((Who))) hated Assad's father? And wants to take out his son because his dad had the temerity to croak without anyone's help?

Blogger Markku April 07, 2017 7:02 AM  

Do you have a public source for that?

Pravda.ru, Google Translate: Recall, on Friday night at the airfield Shayrat in the province of Homs on Friday night fired about 59 rockets . Later it became known that only 23 of them flew to the target. This was told in the Ministry of Defense. "Place the remaining drop 36 cruise missiles is unknown", - said Konashenkov.
Читайте больше на https://www.pravda.ru/news/world/07-04-2017/1330002-russia-0/

Blogger peter blandings April 07, 2017 7:05 AM  

@66 is he the commander in chief, or is he not? if he is, then this was his call. fucking period. there have been red flags since the convention. things that made no sense whatsoever. the thing with general flynn was especially disturbing. trump is known for his loyalty, then he throws flynn under the bus, for what? lying to the vice president? that is bullshit. nobody reports to the vp. no cabinet official has any obligation or duty to say a single fucking word to the vp. flynn did nothing wrong. he was loyal from the beginning. something has stunk in denmark for months. and i'm not freaking out. i'm looking at the facts. and i can tell you this was not coordinated with putin. putin does not sign off on total stupidity.

Anonymous CoolHand April 07, 2017 7:05 AM  

peter blandings wrote:There's that fag talk we talked about...

Do you even read the shit you write before you hit the "publish" button?

FFS...

Blogger JP April 07, 2017 7:08 AM  

So are the Illuminati, Masons and Ummah all part of one big conspiracy, or are they three competing conspiracies? And who do we root for if the latter?

Anonymous basementhomebrewer April 07, 2017 7:13 AM  

Everyone on the positive side is supposing this was Trump letting his people make decision. The other thing in play here is if he made a deal and this was his end of it.

There are enough people domestically, let alone internationally, who wanted this to happen and also have the ability to give the GE something he wants in return. It's a callous way to look at the world but that is how you have to play the game when you are at the head of state level.

Blogger Ken Prescott April 07, 2017 7:13 AM  

Consider this:

Those cruise missiles flew straight through the (rather formidable) Russian/Syrian IADS, and neither the Russians nor the Syrians engaged them. Ergo, this was coordinated with Russia and Syria.

Blogger Stephen April 07, 2017 7:14 AM  

He seemed very awkward in those speeches as if he was being forced to say those things like a hostage. The deep state is deep and merciless.

Blogger IrishFarmer April 07, 2017 7:17 AM  

Funnily enough this is kind of a lose-lose. Either Trump cucked, or a lot of big names in the alt-right are going to habe egg on their face. Although obviously the latter is a much better outcome. Still a lot of people are going to feel pretty dumb either way.

Blogger peter blandings April 07, 2017 7:18 AM  

@79 can't argue with that. excellent point.

Blogger Dire Badger April 07, 2017 7:18 AM  

@78- basementhomebrewer:
No, a lot of us think there's something going on that we don't know about, and we find the timing to be extremely interesting... almost as if Trump were pointing out to the Chinese that when he says "Fix the Nork problem or we will." He was showing that he was serious.

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 7:19 AM  

Ok, I think I know what this is.

Blogger Doom April 07, 2017 7:23 AM  

Don't be too disparaged. Whether one of the Pauls, or that toad billionaire before them, had gotten in, they would have done the same, in these times. Don't be too disappointed with politics and politicians and you will live a happier life.

Now, whether they really know something we don't, or whether (more likely in my opinion) they sold out because the money was just too good... nationally, personally, internationally, or in other ways, who knows... that I can't absolutely say.

No matter who would be made president, sometimes they simply don't have a choice. I think Zero skipped out on choosing by being so stoned he couldn't be allowed to make the choice, so other methods were employed. Still, it's... all the same.

Besides, Trump is, politically, more like you I should think. You should understand this. What you say out of power is not how you would act with power. It isn't even an in incongruence, betrayal. If he builds the wall, that is as much as I honestly can hope from him. The rest will be typical. No choice. Not even sure he will get the wall, to be honest. I'm not sure, anymore, they really have a choice.

Anonymous TS April 07, 2017 7:27 AM  

"In any event, Trump is going to have to learn to stop reacting like an emotionally incontinent woman trained by Pavlov whenever he sees children on television. He was elected to build a wall, send them back, and keep Americans out of war, not play Middle East kingmaker."

Meanwhile there is the whole pedogate issue. Meanwhile there is planned barrenhood and the continuing infanticide. Meanwhile there is cps and its murder and trafficking of children. Yeah but lets get involved in a country using the flimsy pretext of protecting the children there as stated to the un just like the wmd's pretext. And that's not even going into whether such warmongering is constitutional or legal.

Anonymous Really April 07, 2017 7:27 AM  

Ok, I think I know what this is.

Spider Melon, Pharaonic Melon, or Starchild level? Do tell.

Blogger Sun Xhu April 07, 2017 7:30 AM  

My guess: Trump is taking action based on intelligence provided by deep state ops within the intelligence community, with full knowledge of the source.

Why? To purge the intelligence community of these people.

There is word that Trump notified Russia and Syria of the pending attack.

Prediction: Solid evidence will come out to prove that it was as the Russians claimed, that the Syrian attack was a conventional attack that hit a chem weapons factory or cache of the rebels, thus releasing the gas. This will provide the Trump admin with the public justification for purging the people who provided false information to him from within the intelligence community.

Blogger YIH April 07, 2017 7:36 AM  

@16. Is Trump so easily swayed by a few images (regardless of how grisly)?
Remember his background. In construction, injuries are unfortunate, and fatalities are tragic (the general idea is that neither is supposed to happen). But this ain't any kind of chess, it's a whole different game.
I suspect he actually was shocked and horrified that really awful things actually happen in a war zone.
I don't think he was quite ready for that. He ain't sitting on the bench anymore, he's quarterbacking, and I think he overthrew the receiver.

Blogger Ken Prescott April 07, 2017 7:38 AM  

For what it's worth, chemical weapons are a much bigger worry than nukes. Special nuclear material is scarce, and getting a nuclear yield out of it requires a lot of extremely specialized knowledge (which is why Uncle Sam went batshit crazy over Wen Ho Lee--he pretty much left that specialized knowledge accessible to all on an open Internet server in the form of fully-commented source code for hydrodynamic simulations).

Nerve agents are much simpler (they came out of insecticide research), very compact, and First World urban areas are hideously vulnerable to them. That's why there was such an effort to get rid of the damn things among FIRST WORLD nations back in the 1990s. Third World nations are not going to be considered anything resembling reliable custodians for nerve agents; too much chance they'll get lifted.

Chlorine and mustard? No problem, use that crap on each other to your hearts' content. Nerve agent? Yeah, that's going to get a reaction.

Blogger Hunsdon April 07, 2017 7:39 AM  

Last night I said it was getting harder to believe Trump is playing 3D chess . . . and I stand by that statement. That was a first blush reaction, and when I saw the pictures of the airbase it got easier. It was a demonstration, a statement. Compare/contrast with the decapitation strike we launched on Iraq, where we managed to blow up a bunch of waiters and busboys at a Saddam-frequented restaurant. This time? We kinetically interacted with sand.

This is still, of course, concerning. But I woke up this morning, so it's not the end of the world quite yet.

And if my faith in the God-Emperor has taken a body blow, well, everyone gets hit sometimes. Our host is right: let's be concerned, but abandoning the cause? FFS. Goresuch is going to be confirmed today: WIN. The train is fine.

Let's wait a little and see how this all shakes out.

Despair is a sin.

Anonymous glosoli April 07, 2017 7:40 AM  

@39

'Putin isn't a Globalist'

Yes, he's the top guy in the globalist tribe, I find it hard to believe anyone here doesn't see their evil plan, already 100+ years in the making: destroy the US, destroy Christianity, then rule the world under Satan.

Putin's words:

'Of course, the world is changing and the U.N. must be consistent with this natural transformation. Russia stands ready to work together with its partners on the basis of full consensus, but we consider the attempts to undermine the legitimacy of the United Nations as extremely dangerous. They could lead to a collapse of the entire architecture of international organizations, and then indeed there would be no other rules left but the rule of force.

We would get a world dominated by selfishness rather than collective work, a world increasingly characterized by dictate rather than equality.'

Mmm, collective work, sounds lovely doesn't it?
The beast didn't die, it just pretended to die when the USSR broke up. They appear weak, when they're strong. They appear nationalist, when they're globalists. Our side is mostly just fucking blind to it all.

http://mashable.com/2015/09/28/putin-un-speech/#nilHepjkcsqZ

I don't know about Trump, let's see, but it's clear that Russia, China, the Saudis, Israel, every fucker out there really, is keen to take down America, and Christianity.

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 7:40 AM  

Yes, Really. Since you want to be a dick about it, I'll post my guess invisibly on Altrugenics. Aeoli can verify from the admin logs that I didn't edit it in the event I'm correct.

Blogger VD April 07, 2017 7:40 AM  

Either Trump cucked, or a lot of big names in the alt-right are going to habe egg on their face.

That's not true. There are other possibilities, which is precisely why I am advising everyone to take a deep breath, recognize that the God-Emperor has surprised everyone before, and see how this plays out.

Blogger Jamie-R April 07, 2017 7:45 AM  

Putin loves this stuff, America is sick of it.
The mainstream conservative I debated with today:
Him: "They have all their surveillance assets trained at Syria, they knew where Assad launches attacks & where they hit, they can review all the footage, satellite eyes see everything. What they hit wasn't a message it was where they launched the attacks from."
Me: "So he's stupid enough to launch a literal gas attack? Or... Putin & Assad talk and see whether they can challenge a politically-tied Trump down to his own words & see if they've got another President who rolls over, like when Putin killed the Polish President in 2010, and all Obama did was go to his funeral like a cuck. Because this was a serious test, almost proportional to Dead Polish President under a piss-weak leader."

Blogger Sillon Bono April 07, 2017 7:45 AM  

I hope VD is right and there is more to meet the eye on this.

In the mean time this is very demoralizing.

Blogger Jamie-R April 07, 2017 7:46 AM  

Giving Russians short term notice must have meant they told the Arabs "Hey guys just heading off base for some lunch very hungry"

Anonymous W. Lindsay Wheeler April 07, 2017 7:49 AM  

Stephen wrote:He seemed very awkward in those speeches as if he was being forced to say those things like a hostage. The deep state is deep and merciless.

Who is pulling the strings in America is the media. Notice how Trump comes out and "cries" about the dead children. Notice that he says "We all bleed red".

One time I accidentally met with one of those Masonic higher-ups in line at a grocery store. He had a couple of followers with him. This was during the Iraq war and I said out loud, what are we the policeman of the world. This guy pipes up--the poor suffering people, we have to do something, we can't let that stuff happening, in regards to Saddam. The whole tone of his character was SJW with command.

I've been in the US military. The US Military is infected with Masonry as was in Washington's time. Masonry is an American Military tradition and it is this "do-goodism" mentality of Human Rights and that the whole world is under Masonic guidance.

We've been played. Especially by the Media. If the CIA can hack computers and leave evidence that others did it, the CIA created this to give Trump something to do to define and make Trump "presidential". This was a carefully planned psy-op.

Nerve gas? And these people in some remote village had chemical/biological gear on hand? Nerve gas, and one is handling bodies without protection in other flicks. Only "75" people? Really.

This happened in WWI, where American Media broadcast that German soldiers where carrying Belgium babies on their bayonets!

Bannon needs to leave. He lost. Kuschner and his Orthodox rabbis won.

Blogger Cail Corishev April 07, 2017 7:54 AM  

peter blandings and others who are freaking out:

Some are legitimately freaking out; many are pretending to freak out as part of the campaign of defeatism they've been running since the early campaign. If it hadn't been this, they'd have been pretending to freak out about something else today, so don't take all of that too seriously.

Looks like a recoverable blunder to me, but I'll admit there are a couple things that just don't make sense to me about this. When things don't make sense to me, I wait for more information until things do start to make sense, before making definitive judgments (I know, that's cheating). I'm not inclined to any "4D chess" explanations right now, but the easy explanation that Trump has suddenly been suborned by people he ran rings around for months doesn't fit either. So I'm waiting for more info, and I'll be interested in the theory Vox is talking about.

Anonymous LurkingPuppy April 07, 2017 7:56 AM  

Markku wrote:Pravda.ru, Google Translate: Recall, on Friday night at the airfield Shayrat in the province of Homs on Friday night fired about 59 rockets . Later it became known that only 23 of them flew to the target. This was told in the Ministry of Defense. "Place the remaining drop 36 cruise missiles is unknown", - said Konashenkov.
Yow. That is interesting. They still wouldn't have been ‘dummies’ though; what that means is that there were other targets hit during the strike.

Ken Prescott wrote:Those cruise missiles flew straight through the (rather formidable) Russian/Syrian IADS, and neither the Russians nor the Syrians engaged them. Ergo, this was coordinated with Russia and Syria.
Conclusion Does Not Follow. The U.S. should have already known where Syria's AAA sites were and routed the missiles around them. Tomahawks should fly low enough to avoid SAMs, and even if they didn't in this case, SAMs are not cheap enough to spend thinning out an attack with dozens of missiles in which the U.S. had told them what the target was.

Also, https://www.pravda.ru/news/politics/07-04-2017/1329983-lavrov-0/ says the S-400 can only be fired with Moscow's authorization.

Anonymous zebedee April 07, 2017 7:56 AM  

The chemical weapons strike was Putin's means of A/B testing the new administration of the God Emperor. Now he knows that he's not dealing with an Obama. The fact that the GE ordered the strikes and then went to dine with the Chinese president suggests that the message the strike was meant to send also applied to the situation in North Korea as well.

This was about Trump establishing himself as the Alfa Dog of the international community and doing so in an a seemingly impulsive and unpredictable manner. I don't believe for an instant that he intends to deploy American troops to Syria or to launch a strike against North Korea.
If anything I expect he'll use this as a jumping-off point to try and do comprehensive deals on both issues.

Blogger Johnny April 07, 2017 7:58 AM  

It surely does look like we have been played. If we are lucky this is a one time event and the thing can be put to bed, now.

Our ideals about war come from a European period when the 'sport of kings' was not always a to the death event, and it doesn't fit our modern circumstance very well.

Blogger Jamie-R April 07, 2017 7:58 AM  

Kushner worries me, he's a kid, he shouldn't be making any major decisions. He is your typical gliterrati party attending NYC rich kid. No surprise Bannon was stood down 2 days ago at NSC, that was the fallout from the debate over this attack. Bannon wins elections, Kushner buys silly little magazines to win favour with NYC champagne set.

Blogger Elmo Shangnaster April 07, 2017 8:05 AM  

It may appear disappointing, but this seems more like a strategic distraction. Given the test North Korean recent missile test firing, this gives them an indirect warning.

Blogger Jamie-R April 07, 2017 8:06 AM  

Ivanka and Jared will be Trump's downfall if he keeps giving them a pass. His daughter is no different politically than Chelsea Clinton. Jared will be dropped by everyone he knows once Trump loses power and they'll eventually divorce because he's more interested in wooing them. Jews will use a younger incompetent Jew to Jew if they must Jew Trump.

Blogger Lexington Patrick April 07, 2017 8:07 AM  

Marco Rubio is on Fox claiming Assad is a threat to the United States. Assad isn't even a threat to a Foam Party.

Trump needs to take a page out of the Obama playbook and understand that the election never ends. Every move should energize the base, demoralize the opposition and gain more votes.

Trump's flipflop doesn't do any of that.

Trump can easily course correct though - he is a noted practitioner of the art. Lob the missiles and pull out. Sorta like a one night stand with a club chick. Follow up by focusing us on a Supreme Court victory, ram through tax cuts, and then refocus on repealing Obamacare (the right way).

All of that will make this mistake a distant memory like Reagan's bombing of Libya

Anonymous Opus April 07, 2017 8:11 AM  

Really disappointed.

Anonymous Rocklea April 07, 2017 8:12 AM  

Kinetic Tweeting
Tomahawk Rhetoric
Popcorn

Anonymous CarpeOro April 07, 2017 8:16 AM  

Mixed feelings on this. Generally hate the getting involved deeper in the Mideast morass - which if Trump ends up acting like every president after Reagan is directly where things are going. However, as VD is advising, there could be another layer to this entirely. If you read and actually understood Machiavelli you'll know what VD was alluding too. That is what I hope is happening.

Blogger Al From Bay Shore April 07, 2017 8:16 AM  

Bill Mitchell Tweeted something about "Trump threading the needle." There are facts to support this assertion. At the same time Molyneux pointed out Assad's progress against the jihadis and the accusation that he used gas is doubtful. I'm going to step away and watch this unfold.

Blogger Lazarus April 07, 2017 8:21 AM  

I am looking forward to today's Rasmussen Presidential tracking poll. Yesterday approval was 46%.

Blogger Wanda Sherratt April 07, 2017 8:25 AM  

53 - "Exactly right, people wearing sackcloth and ashes while bemoaning their decision to vote for the GE back in November seem to be forgetting how much worse it could be."

I'm afraid that palliative is past its expiry date. We heard that non-stop during the Bush years: "Would you prefer GORE had won?!" It was used to excuse every idiotic move Bush made, and there were plenty. 2016 was the year we realized that it wouldn't have mattered one bit if Gore had won. No matter who was president, nothing ever got in the way of the never-satiated swarm of locusts eating out the country. If Trump continues to feed that swarm, then it won't matter that he beat the diseased sow who ran against him - the result is just the same old story of plundering and abuse that's been going on for decades.

Anonymous Grayman April 07, 2017 8:26 AM  

When do we start bombing the Swedish government to protect the women and children from the brown hordes?


https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRYisJhGdsxXG1-_gN8ziBbRozlaiFSyb4KfPbDO6_6UEXTqBYs

Blogger Jack Ward April 07, 2017 8:28 AM  

Pravda says 36 CM went missing? WTF?
Possibilities:
36 CM landed on something. Perhaps Isis targets that were too sensitive to hit openly?
Trump really is smoking out folks in intelligence, deep state, GOP party, who the hell knows?
Conspiracy stuff: The modulated microwaves have been turned on Trump.
Or, they were turned off.
Yeah, at first I was appalled. I go with Vox now. Wait and see. The games are complex and we don't have the battlefield intel to play them here. Sure, it makes good for popcorn and bourbon but that only goes so far. We have to really hope our candidate knows what the heck he's doing [and, Bannan, too, for that matter].
Too bad Tom Clancy isn't around anymore. What a book this would make.

Blogger peter blandings April 07, 2017 8:32 AM  

Put on your big girl pants. You have ABSOLUTELY no idea what is actually going on.

yeah, i do. i've seen this movie a lot more times than you have. they always say, oh the government knows all kinds of things that you don't. like in korea. like in vietnam. like in the first gulf war. like in afghanistan. like in weapons of mass destruction in iraq. like in destroying libya. like in destroying yemen. like in bombing syria for the last 5 years. besides hundreds of thousands of american soldiers dead and maimed, and trillions of dollars of debt, what did we get exactly? after 60+ years of watching and listening i have a pretty good idea of what's actually going on, and the government doesn't know shit. if i can find those big girl pants, i'll put 'em on for ya. i'm not disparaging trump. i don't believe he wanted the raid in yemen and i don't believe he wanted the syria attack. both events go against everything he said in the campaign. i believe he is being coerced and threatened by certain elements of the CIA. somehow, those of us who were for him from day one need to help him now. our duty doesn't end on election day.

Anonymous Grayman April 07, 2017 8:33 AM  

Clearly we have to protect the women and children of Sweden. How about this example, this Somali rapes a woman to death and then continues with the ACT until caught. Sweet and refuses to deport him

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/3099584/posts

There are photos of the crime scene floating around the web if you really want your stomach turned




Anonymous Jeff April 07, 2017 8:37 AM  

VD is rightly following Rule #1.

Never underestimate Trump.

It is admittedly very difficult to follow the rule given the current situation but I stand with VD and the GE for now.

Blogger GAHCindy April 07, 2017 8:38 AM  

One thing I'm certain of is that Trump didn't do this because of the media, the optics, or for political manipulations. He's way too straightforward and (I really do think) adverse to the globalist, warmonger agenda) I'm certain he did it because he thought it was the right thing to do. Not terribly comforting, since it was most likely not the right thing to do. Either he's falling for neo-con lies, or we're all sorely lacking the information needed to make a judgment. I am disappointed. I'm hoping information will come to light that mitigates that. This says awful things about who has Trump's ear.

Blogger SemiSpook37 April 07, 2017 8:44 AM  

My initial reaction was, "Well, great. Here we go again."

However...after reading Vox's thoughts (both in the OP and subsequent comments), I'm inclined to agree with his assessment. There's a hell of a lot more here than most of us realize. Someone mentioned above that the GE is "threading the needle" on this. The fact that it was only a few dozen Tomahawks focused (mainly) on the alleged source of the original "attack" is pretty telling, too.

Is it a blunder? Sure. That much is obvious. Then again, if it was truly a neocon push, then why the hell was Bannon in on the NSC meeting yesterday afternoon? You know, after he "lost" his clearance.

Stay tuned, kids. Show's about to get interesting.

Blogger Dexter April 07, 2017 8:44 AM  

Scott Adams:

So how does a Master Persuader respond to a fake war crime?

He does it with a fake response, if he’s smart.


That's what we just saw.

We warned Russia (and thus Syria) in advance of the strike, and it didn't do anything. Couldn't be more fake.

Blogger Cail Corishev April 07, 2017 8:47 AM  

@116 Jeff, ironically, the defeatism shills make it easier for me to be hopeful. It's just become a habit to assume the opposite of whatever they're selling. When two dozen of them (most with names I don't recognize) show up yelling "This tears it, Trump just lost my very valuable support!" my knee-jerk response is to support him harder because I don't want to be like them.

Of course, it's possible they'll finally be right about something, like a broken clock. But in that case, I know I can count on them to double down until they've overplayed their hand, so taking the opposite stance still makes the most sense.

Anonymous Ryan ATL April 07, 2017 8:49 AM  

What's so wrong with sending troops to fight (and possibly die)? I mean isn't that what they volunteer for, and what taxpayers pay for?

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 8:50 AM  

> What's so wrong with sending troops to fight (and possibly die)? I mean isn't that what they volunteer for, and what taxpayers pay for?

Absolutely! It's like joining the Stormtroopers on Star Wars! Except your boss isn't a snappy dresser like Darth Vader, but a bitch voter like Ryan ATL. Sad!

Blogger Robert Divinity April 07, 2017 8:51 AM  

What happens next will be determinative, of course. If Trump continues to go down this path he is toast. If he convenes a summit with Putin and achieves a modus vivendi, this alarming development will make total sense.

The Banana Empire is utterly corrupt and a dangerous actor in the world. Trump probably did the minimum required not to reach room temperature. The attack does appear extremely targeted and shouldn't make relations with Russia irreparable, which is the ultimate goal of the neocons and monsters who run our battered junta.

Blogger Andy Texan April 07, 2017 8:58 AM  

My 2 cents is that until the President consolidates power in the government, he cannot buck the world establishment on foreign affairs. He made the decision to be iconoclastic on domestic policy but go with the establishment on foreign policy in order to survive. This explains his rapid retreat in Russia relations (and Syria crap). Hopefully after getting a better grip on power, he can steer foreign relations more in the détente with Russia directions. This whole thing matter looks very staged.

Blogger Stephen Davenport April 07, 2017 8:58 AM  

Basically you are a libertarian Vox, with the no military user at all costs because the Russians didn't give us permission. Obama made us look like a pussy and yet you are ready to piss your pants because Trump struck an air base, in shitsville, Syria. All because the Russians might get mad. Fucking idiot.

Anonymous Carlos Danger April 07, 2017 9:00 AM  

The chemical attack was a false flag with certainty. Sarin and all nerve agents cause projectile vomiting, evacuation of the bowels, severe contortions, and are highly toxic for the rescue personnel. Notice the rescue personnel had no protective gear at all except for surgical masks. Trace amounts of Sarin gas will at a minimum cause major nerve damage and are usually lethal.

Blogger Orville April 07, 2017 9:01 AM  

Russian news is saying the strike was particularly ineffective. It didn't even damage the runways or taxiways. This was a "fake" attack, but it leads me to believe that Mattis and Co. were in on the fakery.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-04-07/first-images-aftermath-inefficient-us-missile-strikes-emerge

Blogger James Dixon April 07, 2017 9:04 AM  

I have no idea why Trump decided on the attack. With the information currently available to the public, there's no justification for doing so. I'm sure he has better information than we do, but is it from reliable sources? If those sources involve the CIA or other security agencies, the answer is almost definitely no.

That said, a cruise missile strike is one of our least entangling attack methods, and if that's all Trump does, then we consider this a minor failure.

Blogger Tom Kratman April 07, 2017 9:05 AM  

I wouldn't have done it, but then I am on the side of the Syrian government. Why? Given a choice between the secular fascist with the moderately good looking western-dressed wife the Islamist loon married to a large Glad bag but with a number of slave girls, always go with the secular fascist.

That said, I suspect simple posturing. We - wisely, IMNSHO - warned the Russians it was coming. That means the Syrians knew, too. That means that they probably didn't have anything on the base that really mattered. Me, in their shoes, I'd have rolled out whatever was available in their Air Force museum and at the front gate of every airbase, put a couple of 55 gallon drums of gas underneath them plus a 500 pounder, and then fired up the microwave with some popcorn and enjoyed the show.

Or the Russians could have said, "Evacuate what matters, your trained ground and air crew. We'll replace the planes."

Bet Trump's popularity among the International Community Of The Ever So Caring And Sensitive (ICOTESCAS, Marca Registrada) goes up quite a bit from this.

Blogger Orville April 07, 2017 9:07 AM  

OMG! Trump just launched nukes from orbit!

on the H1B program :-). "Programmers" are now not a protected class, and there will be spot checks at large tech companies for abuse. Tech industry is no longer afraid the H1B program will be weakened, but will disappear altogether.

More Winning!

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-04-06/trump-takes-direct-aim-h-1b-visa-program-rule-changes

Anonymous Jay Will April 07, 2017 9:09 AM  

Free Syria Army (lol) fear retaliation from Assad. Expect more fake attacks forcing Trump to get involved more and depose The Evil Butcher Assad. Expect to see Assad with his pants round his ankles shortly.

Long Live Israel!

Blogger Chiva April 07, 2017 9:10 AM  

If Trump wanted to start something he would NOT have warned the Russians. I think this is Trumps way of stating to the world "There's a new sheriff in town".

Anonymous Iacobus April 07, 2017 9:13 AM  

Stephen Davenport wrote:Basically you are a libertarian Vox, with the no military user at all costs because the Russians didn't give us permission. Obama made us look like a pussy and yet you are ready to piss your pants because Trump struck an air base, in shitsville, Syria. All because the Russians might get mad. Fucking idiot.

George W. Bush, is that you?

Pray tell, why should we give a shit about the Syrians, again, especially where we have our own backyard to clean up? I'll wait.

Blogger Dexter April 07, 2017 9:13 AM  

Russian news is saying the strike was particularly ineffective. It didn't even damage the runways or taxiways.

Well duh you don't use cruise missiles on runways, you use bombs. We know how to destroy runways if we want to.

Anonymous Napoleon 12pdr April 07, 2017 9:14 AM  

My take: Trump is genuine in being appalled at the use of chemical weapons. He's trying to get those taken out...but would prefer that the Russians do it.

When Obama ran away, he left a power vacuum that Putin exploited. I don't think the Russians give a damn for Assad's regime. They want a warm-water naval base on the Med. it's been on their to-get list for 300 years.

Trump might well be thinking that it's worth trading that for Russian aid in stabilizing the area. Which also takes a lot of refugee pressure off Europe.

Cheer up. TLAMs aren't troops. The time to worry is when he sends the Army, not the Navy.

Blogger Markku April 07, 2017 9:16 AM  

but then I am on the side of the Syrian government.

I'm absolutely fucking 110% on the side of the Syrian government.

Blogger Robert Divinity April 07, 2017 9:17 AM  

That said, I suspect simple posturing. We - wisely, IMNSHO - warned the Russians it was coming. That means the Syrians knew, too.

I think the same, and certainly hope so. Let's hope this was kabuki to pave the way for a grand bargain with Putin next week.

Blogger Orville April 07, 2017 9:18 AM  

@133 You are missing the point Dexter. It was Kabuki theater.

Blogger Jonathan Wales April 07, 2017 9:19 AM  

Potential terror attack in Sweden now. Truck driven into people. We seem to be fighting the wrong people. Again.

Anonymous Napoleon 12pdr April 07, 2017 9:20 AM  

I'll add that this gives Trump maneuvering room with regard to the notion that he's some sort of Russian puppet. It also established that he's willing to use force...with limited warning.

Anonymous Avalanche April 07, 2017 9:20 AM  

@24 "He seemed to take personal umbrage at the attack."

The thing that worries me, (and I read a comment somewhere on the web, so it must be true) is: *IVANKA* was horribly upset by the dying-babies pix and came running to daddy to fix it. I don't know enough about Ivanka (does anyone?) to know if this could be true or would be likely.

I WISH there were a WAY for "the base" to remind Trump we're out here! I was thinking (fruitlessly) of: maybe we could start one of the obamination's "petitions to the govt" to refocus on the Wall, the illegal aliens, the legal aliens, and DACA-Dreamers-anchor-babies (and their mothers and their sisters and their aunts!) -- the things we REALLY care about!! Syria is SO not our business!

EVEN trusting the God Emperor to be playing 5-level chess, 10 moves ahead of where I can see: I don't see any 'movement' on the things we (certainly, *I*) elected him for! (And then, I soothe myself: he hasn't even been in office THREE MONTHS!!)

Anyone know a good place to keep track of the stuff our God Emperor is doing that is neither castigated (er... "reported": that's what they call it!) by the MSM/leftie-libs, nor mentioned on the Right? Well, there is Infogalatic news (and thank you tremendously for that, Dark Lord!) -- but that's news, not a solid, trustworthy (ongoing) list of what President Trump is doing all day, every day...

Anonymous Ironsides April 07, 2017 9:21 AM  

I've forced myself to remain optimistic, but at this point, it's difficult for me to keep saying that the God-Emperor's New Clothes have such a magnificent 4D cut that simple souls like myself just can't see them, when they are in fact invisible and probably don't exist. Honestly, this "4D Chess" stuff is starting to exactly resemble the Emperor's new clothes story.

Blogger Ken Prescott April 07, 2017 9:23 AM  

If S-400 can't be fired without Moscow's permission, then it's useless as an air defense asset.

Modern SAMs (and the S-300 is pretty modern by itself) can engage low altitude targets like cruise missiles. Low altitude also means that they're horribly vulnerable to AAA. And evasive routing of cruise missiles can only do so much. The endgame still requires them to traverse a death zone of close-in SAMs and AAA--with the defenders getting about 30 minutes' notice.

Again: the IADS saw something, and did nothing. Coupled with 36 missiles that went elsewhere...well, the game is afoot.

Anonymous Rocklea April 07, 2017 9:24 AM  

The media sure seems overjoyed. Dead cat bounce.

How will this effect Le Pen? Unless the deeper game involves a Russian redemption, I think poorly.

This 'unpredictable' return to a familiar narrative, may actually be giving people amygdala relief, driving them to the familiar centre. Externalize the threat to relieve internal pressure. Absent more cultural enrichment in the interim that is.

The Australian Uniparty is doing backflips in support of Trump. Our Foreign Minister, Julie Bishop, wants Trump "to go after those responsible for arming Syria, The Russians and Iran". The Greens condemned the strike saying he should have waited for an investigation.

Kinetic Tweeting aside, they still need to go back.
This was rhetoric for the MSM, dialectic for the Chinese and the Hermit Kingdom, and pabulum for the masses.

OpenID paworldandtimes April 07, 2017 9:24 AM  

I WISH there were a WAY for "the base" to remind Trump we're out here!

Waves of twitter communication with his two adult sons.

PA

Anonymous b April 07, 2017 9:24 AM  

Interesting that Her Royal Hillarynous called for this identical action *2 hours* before it was done. Who leaked it to her? Is it a crime to receive/solicit classified info and publicly disseminate it?

Anonymous Jay Will April 07, 2017 9:26 AM  

Secretly people love war. As long as its not them fighting it.

Blogger pyrrhus April 07, 2017 9:26 AM  

Trump cannot possibly believe that this "attack" was anything except a false flag or pure hoax. Medics handling people exposed to sarin gas with bare hands suggests that it might be the latter...So Trump is apparently a hostage to Goldman/Deep State....

Anonymous Jay Will April 07, 2017 9:28 AM  

"Interesting that Her Royal Hillarynous called for this identical action *2 hours* before it was done. Who leaked it to her? Is it a crime to receive/solicit classified info and publicly disseminate it?"

Its a boast. Deep State wins. I knew what Trump was going to do before he did.

Anonymous Avalanche April 07, 2017 9:28 AM  

@30 "Alternatively it is not stupid, but smart, only we don't see it. Either because
a) we don't know everything that's going on behind the scenes"

And while everyone is focused on the ME: have 'we' forgotten North Korea? Showing that Trump DOES (well *can*) have an itchy finger may be a good thing for the wee-missile-monger to learn. (And maybe China as well?)

Not a molasses-speed response (even to what may be false reports) but an immediate whack to make the point might -- if not reach the dictator -- at least reach the advisors and operators in NKorea wishing to keep their country alive...

Whipping one gang's member to warn off a different / stronger / worse / crazier gang's members?

Blogger Some Guy April 07, 2017 9:30 AM  

@VD

"That's not true. There are other possibilities, which is precisely why I am advising everyone to take a deep breath, recognize that the God-Emperor has surprised everyone before, and see how this plays out."

Do you think this is long game dealing with North Korea? It happened just before the talks with Xi and Trump loves to walk into a negotiation with controlled Chaos as the backdrop. This might be a political play to convince China that he is serious about military intervention.

Anonymous james@wpc April 07, 2017 9:31 AM  

"Bungle or Complete Debacle?"

Complete Fucking Debacle. This is a win-win for the psychopathic bankster owned Neocons whatever happens and a lose-lose for Trump whatever happens. This has all been scripted and set up over months.

Anonymous krymneth April 07, 2017 9:31 AM  

Who actually died? I don't have time to study the news right now, but I've only gotten negatives about who it wasn't. Is there anywhere that says who it was? Honest question. (And possibly an important one.)

Blogger Stilicho April 07, 2017 9:32 AM  

If the Russians would do their damned job and help the Alawites and Christians take out ISIS, Assad wouldn't be using chemical weapons or be susceptible to credible accusations of such use.

On another note, I do wonder what, exactly, we took out with 59 cruise missiles? It could be that we use the possibly faked sarin attack as an excuse to take out assets (Russian or Iranian) that Trump thought posed a real threat. Just to send a message that we are watching and will not tolerate certain threats...

Blogger Orville April 07, 2017 9:33 AM  

As Vox said, Trump's M.O. is the crazy, unpredictable bastard. He moves with certainty within the chaos.

Blogger Theproductofafineeduction April 07, 2017 9:36 AM  

Chill the fuck out and stop menstruating on the blog. I find it baffling that so many on this blog will argue about ruthless, corrupt, evil and pervasive the deep state is and how difficult a slog this is going to be to put things right, but then lose their shit when something apparently goes a wry.

We have no fucking clue what is really going on in either Syria or the Hill. We do not have access to special insider info and we aren't more capable at navigating the treacherous waters than he man who is currently in office (this has empirically been illustrates). So to repeat Vox, everyone needs to put their tampons in, shut up and see where this goes.

Anonymous Grayman April 07, 2017 9:37 AM  

Jay Will wrote:Secretly people love war. As long as its not them fighting it.

No they don’t. They love entertainment, Panem et Circenses. Start showing people “real” war. Show them liveleak videos of someone missing half of their body, laying on the ground, still conscious for the last few seconds of their life. Show the soldier walking numbly along with a ragged bloody stump where his arm was…. Show this and the burned, charred civilian casualties every night on the MSM up close and personal.
Show people real war and they will have no stomach for casual war. Casual war is highly counterproductive and degrades/debases those who engage in it. War should be fought with fully open eye. Fully understanding the horror and the human cost and as such should only be engaged in when as a society you are willing to fully eradicate the mortal threat facing you understanding the horror that implies.
If you are not prepared to slaughter your enemy to the man, to raze his cities until he begs for peace, you have no business going to war. Either you as society lack the fortitude or the threat is not real, it’s just another banker bailout.

Blogger Nate April 07, 2017 9:37 AM  


"Put on your big girl pants. You have ABSOLUTELY no idea what is actually going on. FFS, at least half the "cruise missiles" were dummies anyhow."

I find your blind faith in TV obsessed baby-boomers disturbing.

Blogger Martin April 07, 2017 9:38 AM  

As a non american I just realized that USA is unreformable. You are, always have been, and always will be, a menace.

Anonymous Avalanche April 07, 2017 9:39 AM  

@60 "there is no reconciliation with russia now."

Do you need some time in your safe room? Have a puppy.

(Sheesh! The wailing!)

Anonymous Ryan ATL April 07, 2017 9:39 AM  

Star wars is a just a movie bro.

Blogger Josh (the gayest thing here) April 07, 2017 9:39 AM  

I find your blind faith in TV obsessed baby-boomers disturbing.

Trump watches a whole 2 hrs less tv than the average boomer!

Blogger John rockwell April 07, 2017 9:41 AM  

@Avalanche

That's why we must "Ignore Thot orders'' Women in politics is a disaster.

Anonymous johnc April 07, 2017 9:42 AM  

There are now reports that 9 civilians -- including 4 children -- were killed in the strikes.

Hopefully they have some pictures to show Ivanka. Maybe Nikki can show them to the UN as well.

Anonymous Lit Dog April 07, 2017 9:42 AM  

Even assuming there’s a secret 4D strategy, Trump has irreparably harmed his credibility with his base, and I believe that’s more important to his enemies than toppling Assad. It is they who have played Trump, but it’s not 4D chess. It’s a very simple tactic employed throughout the centuries: butter up and goad your enemy into slitting his own throat.

Remember Bush I’s 1992 campaign promise: Read My Lips, No New Taxes? Once elected, the Dems & media played him to do the statesmen thing and raise taxes. After he did, the Dems and media forgot the statesmen part and relentlessly reminded Americans of Bush’s broken promise.

And they did this in spite of Bush having given Israel the first Gulf War. Will they be kinder after Trump gives Israel Assad’s regime?

Blogger Mr.MantraMan April 07, 2017 9:43 AM  

So the 27 year old war continues and IMO still losing.

Blogger Nate April 07, 2017 9:46 AM  

The Alt-Right... As an 80's Sitcom:

Scene: Trump House. Father Trump... at a family meeting with his sons vox, prison planet, and cerno


Trump: Kids... I have to tell you something.. I just blew all our money on coke, whores, and this lottery ticket.

Cerno: YOU DID WHAT? Dad this is so stupid. This is the kind of crap mom did and that's why we put her in the nut house. Screw it I'm moving to Argentina.

PrisonPlanet: Oh Jesus Christ... I'm out. I'm moving in with LePen

midget in a white suit (running across the room): LE PEN! LE PEN!

Vox: GUYS GUYS! Wait settle down.. maybe its a plan! Dad is really smart! Maybe he rigged the lottery and we'll all be super rich! Lets just wait and see how it plays out!

Gary Colmen enters: Whatchu talkin' bout Vox?

Anonymous Longtime Lurker April 07, 2017 9:46 AM  

I don't see Neocon influence so much as I see the traditional Washington foreign policy/military establishment pushing President Trump to undertake actions that said establishment believes will repair the Obama-era damage to U.S. prestige (i.e., reputation for exercising power).

This process started with North Korea ("policy of strategic patience is at an end"), shifted to Europe (with the focus on strengthening deterrence against Russia), then the Middle East, first with Yemen (airstrikes are at record levels), and now Syria.

Message to the Geopolitical Street: The Obama era is over. President Trump can and will use military force--on short notice--to protect vital U.S. interests (as he understands such interests).

Anonymous Avalanche April 07, 2017 9:47 AM  

@68 "I now feel about him basically as I do about National Review and JEB and Paul Ryan and their ilk: loathing."

Good lord folks! In **less than three months** you've gone from "Hail our God Emperor; we're your army and at least now we have a chance" to "he's crap, I'm taking my ball(s) and going home."

There is NO proof that Trump has gone wrong or made a misstep, but certainly a threadful and more of proof all you whiners are NO KIND OF SOLDIERS!! This is barely even one of the first "battles"; we don't even KNOW yet if "we" have won or lost -- and you're rocking back and forth in a fetal position whining that "it's all over; the general doesn't have any idea what to do" and you've FORGOTTEN every previous battle he won -- and man-oh-man he won BIG!! ("President" -- remember?!)

Geez! Ever heard of FAITH!?!?

Anonymous W Lindsay Wheeler April 07, 2017 9:47 AM  

In January, 2013, a British defense contractor was outed by leaked emails, stating that they were going to "stage a chemical attack" in Syria and blame Assad.

Here is the link: http://www.hangthebankers.com/hacked-emails-reveal-washington-approved-plan-to-stage-chemical-weapons-attack-in-syria/

Ohh, and I get a laugh at the TV commentators, "This is about national security". National Security? Syria is 5000 miles away and what happens in Syria is our concern how?


Blogger Mr.MantraMan April 07, 2017 9:48 AM  

If true about Ivanka then a real man is needed who pats her ass and whispers in her ear to go cook a good meal, break out a good bottle of wine and put on a nice dress and think about that vigorous adult playtime after the meal and wine.

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar April 07, 2017 9:50 AM  

I think if played out properly that this strike is full of win. Enough evidence has been presented to justify the attack, Russia was given warning so the target should have suffered few casualties, and God-Emperor is now a wartime President in command of the armed forces. McCainians may be more inclined to support domestic legislation and Obama looks more indecisive in retrospect. Networks have been forced to report the failure of US and international authorities to effect Syrian disarmament. Yes, this could become a debacle, but I don't think that Mr. Trump will fall for that. This looks like a display of "peace through strength" and will send a message to others, including a particular world leader currently being entertained at Mar-a-Lago.

Anonymous Gurpgork April 07, 2017 9:50 AM  

I'm hoping this is a genius play from Trump and not just a mistake. The sequence of events is weird to me. A few days ago they were still anti intervention in Syria. Bannon is distanced from the NSC for some reason. (in the media at least)
So my ideal scenario would be something like this:
- The chemical attack is a false flag
- People on the NSC know it's a false flag but push for a strike anyway, Trump has proof they know.
- He allows the strike to go ahead
- Revelation of the false flag and the ill intent of certain people in the NSC
- Since their lies caused an act of war on a sovereign country they all get tried for treason and strung up on the white house lawn or shipped to guantanamo

Ah well, a man can dream :-)

Blogger Nate April 07, 2017 9:51 AM  

"Ohh, and I get a laugh at the TV commentators, "This is about national security". National Security? Syria is 5000 miles away and what happens in Syria is our concern how?"

DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT THE TV OBSESSED BABY BOOMER IN CHIEF SAW DEAD KIDS ON TV???

Anonymous Grayman April 07, 2017 9:55 AM  

Orville wrote:Russian news is saying the strike was particularly ineffective. It didn't even damage the runways or taxiways. This was a "fake" attack, but it leads me to believe that Mattis and Co. were in on the fakery.

target="_blank" rel="nofollow" href="http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-04-07/first-images-aftermath-inefficient-us-missile-strikes-emerge">http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-04-07/first-images-aftermath-inefficient-us-missile-strikes-emerge


Orville is correct, look at the images in the link. US cruise missiles, and 59 of them at that, do not miss something as large as a runway. We are perfectly capable to wiping out an airfield and the planes in their bunkers.

Pay attention to this blurb from the end of the article:

Additionally, Russia says Syrian air defense systems will be bolstered after 6 jets and the radar system was destroyed in the airstrike. 4 Syrian military are reported dead and 2 missing after strike

Trump just handed Russia an excuse to upgrade the Syrian military when everyone was shrieking about that being done before. Trump may very well have just given Putin cover for Russia upgrading their air defenses to fully counter Israeli airpower.

This was not a neocon military entanglement. Trump didn’t “accidentally” drop tons of ammo to Saudi backed terrorists, he didn’t fund the wrong team with billions of dollars, etc. This was cover for some other action, As someone else pointed out 29 cruise missiles “missed”….. That many do not miss, where did they go, that would be interesting to know.


I still think we need to bomb Sweden. ;)

Blogger tz April 07, 2017 9:55 AM  

Eexcept T-Rex and the God Emperor are calling for Assad to go the way of Quadaffi and Hussein.
Two traps.
1. All the neocon and MSM is cheering Trump for this, and you can be damned even more easily with strong praise.
2. Bush and Obama/Hillary just did it wrong and his wormtongue advisers are saying he is now the world's top cop and can fix everything - America great as a brutal international bully, though they won't use those terms.

I voted to make the US homeland great again, not burn 10s of millions (2% of the cost of the border wall) in missiles over some false flag.

Assad killed Children? Planned Parenthood is still funded and is dismembering and crushing the skulls of babies today.

At Gettysburg, Trump made a number of specific 100 days promises. Ousting Assad was not one of them.

Nor will picking a fight with Putin end well. Russians have had to endure much and aren't snowflakes. I wonder if Putin will try to provoke Erdogan into invoking Article 5 of NATO.

Blogger Nate April 07, 2017 9:57 AM  

"Assad killed Children? Planned Parenthood is still funded and is dismembering and crushing the skulls of babies today."

yes but the baby boomer in chief won't be watching that on television.

Anonymous Athor Pel April 07, 2017 9:58 AM  

Different types of ordnance require different protocols for use.

If the Syrian air force uses Russian ground control protocols then much more of the detail involved in flying the plane and employing the ordnance makes its way to the airwaves.

If Assad's air force dropped chemical munitions the signals intel from the plane(s) would indicate that the pilot(s) followed a chemical weapon flight and weapon deployment profile.

How a war plane is prepared and flown is different for each ordnance type. How the ordnance acts after it leaves the plane is different. For those that emit it the telemtry is different for each type.

The US is going to have eyes and ears on everything going on in Syria. If it emits electromagnetic energy it's going to be hoovered up. If there happen to be US special operations folks wandering around nearby their eyeballs are going to be watching any tactically or strategically important events unfold.

Whether it was Syria that employed the chemical ordnance or someone else we here do not know. All I'm saying, if Syria did it and they followed normal radio protocols there would be evidence available for intercept. Of course the whole thing could be spoofed, meaning all the radio chatter put on like a play with ordnance detonated on the ground while US radio intercept folks record it and report it with that signals 'intelligence' ending up on the president's desk not long after that.

Anonymous BbigGayKoranBurner April 07, 2017 10:02 AM  

It makes no sense for Assad to do a chem attack to kill 80 people when Indian safety engineers can kill 16,000 as seen in Bhopal India without any attack. Moslems raped to death 300 schoolkids at Beslan Russia, what if conventional attack hit a Bhopal? At over $1 mill a Cruz missile this attack cost more than Obama's niglets going on spring break, and they missed their target at Langley if they wanted who was responsible for the Syrian mess.

"it also makes it seem that stories about Trump being Putin's man that much more ridiculous."

I would have been willing to have my picture taken with PUTIN for less than the taxpayer paid for Obama's niglets to go on spring break.

All Russian news sources are reporting that six soldiers have been killed (was previously seven - perhaps one was thought dead but was merely badly wounded) and about the same amount were wounded.

Black gangbangers hit their targets more often than $1 mill missiles

(2) USA lobs 3 score Tomahawks (1000 pound warheads) at a Syrian airbase -- after warning the Russians, who told the Syrians. Thus human casualties were low.

Maybe they only had suspected moslems on guard at the time. “Hey everyone the Russians are treating us to a pig roast over at Piggly Wiggly.”



I thought it was just the gay jews that hated Bibi?

OpenID paworldandtimes April 07, 2017 10:03 AM  

DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT THE TV OBSESSED BABY BOOMER IN CHIEF SAW DEAD KIDS ON TV???

The Christian kids in ISIS cages that everybody and his aunt passed around on Facebook had no impact because they were not on television.

PA

Blogger Whisker biscuit April 07, 2017 10:05 AM  

You gotta work ALF into that somewhere...

Blogger Johnny April 07, 2017 10:06 AM  

The best possible take on this is that it is a one strike event that will put the story to rest. If we don't do more and we continue to act in a way that is constructive in the region, the other side will forgive and forget.

By my lights the big even right now is the new Supreme Court nominee. If Trump wants to use the Justice department aggressively he needs a court that is actually interested in enforcing the law, and currently that means conservative.

Blogger praetorian April 07, 2017 10:11 AM  

I've already written it out for the record; if events proceed accordingly, I'll post it after the fact.

Maybe post a sha-256 of it that you can reference later for verification?

One theory that I'm seeing is that this is Trump shoring up the neocons to get Gorsuch over the line. Plausible.

Blogger James Dixon April 07, 2017 10:12 AM  

> As a non american I just realized that USA is unreformable. You are, always have been, and always will be, a menace.

Congratulations. Welcome to the real world. Now, with a population of just over 300M, if we're a menace, what does that make China and India?

Anonymous Lit Dog April 07, 2017 10:14 AM  

Sorry. Read My Lips was a 1988 campaign promise. It was used against Bush in 1992.

Blogger Dave April 07, 2017 10:16 AM  

"The other is a much bigger one which I will not discuss in public, but would be very surprising and significant indeed."

Double-secret probation, perhaps?

Anonymous DissidentRight April 07, 2017 10:21 AM  

The other is a much bigger one which I will not discuss in public

Here's hoping!

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 10:23 AM  

Most importantly, Trump blowing stuff up proves that he's king.

The levels of funny and awesome in this thing just keep piling up.

Russia doubling down in Syria? Oh well! Tough yamulkas.

Blogger Conan the Cimmerian April 07, 2017 10:23 AM  

Alf for the win

Anonymous Jay Will April 07, 2017 10:26 AM  

@ Grayman

I mean war as its put to the public, because that's what they are reacting to, not war as it is. MPAI! And people love what is put to them. US president approval ratings increase during war. The progs all support getting the evil dictators out. Viewing figures go up there's a buzz that goes round. THEY know this.

If Trump goes ahead and topples the Evil Butcher Assad then Donald Trump is fake news! Another puppet show just like Hope and Change Obama. A show for the masses. And what a show it's been!!

Blogger Cail Corishev April 07, 2017 10:26 AM  

War is a very serious business; would that U.S. politicians and generals would learn to treat it that way.

Yes. Most of us cheered, and rightly so, as the president chose military men like Mattis. They are certainly an upgrade from the diversity warriors and butch lesbians who had been running things. But the obvious downside to it is that military men tend to push military solutions; and they can present them in a way that suggests if you don't go along with their very reasonable plan, you're probably a pussy.

The neo-cons are the worst, but I don't think any of them are immune from that. If President Trump doesn't want to get dragged into pointless conflicts across the globe and let that distract from his primary goals, he's going to have to be able to say no to the people around him. This one may blow over, and may even have been more artfully done than we know, but that's no guarantee that the next one will.

I'm sure it's harder, now that it's not a theoretical question in an interview and he's the one making the decision himself, with a bunch of people around him saying, "People are dying and you can stop it with a word, and look, we have this shiny plan that can't go wrong." He's going to have to start saying no anyway, because they will always have a reason and a shiny new plan.

Blogger LES April 07, 2017 10:32 AM  

Drudge poll says 65% approve bombing. Christian Zionists believe Syria belongs to Greater Israel.

Anonymous Owen April 07, 2017 10:33 AM  

I’m definitely disappointed by this, and I’ll admit it doesn’t look good. Still, this is only one incident and the first real disappointment of his presidency. Add to that the reports that Russia was notified in advance and you have some evidence that there was a deliberate effort to avoid the WWWIII escalation some fear.

Still, despair accomplishes nothing. I’ll be willing to call Trump a fraud when he orders a full invasion of Syria and calls Putin a threat to civilization. Until then, I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I understand why so many are upset by this; I too voted for Trump as a “peace president.” Nevertheless, its disheartening to see so many willing to write him off as a puppet. Nothing wrong with telling him and the world that you think this was a bad move, but I think Trump has earned a little bit of faith.

Trump is only human, but let’s not forget he played a difficult game and managed to kill the two biggest and best funded political dynasties with no prior political experience. It’s possible there’s a long-game we aren’t seeing; it’s possible Trump made a dumb decision and will reconsider after seeing how his supporters and people like Coulter are reacting; it’s possible he’ll smell a rat when he realizes all the Democrats and Neocons are applauding this. Let’s see what happens next before giving up on him.

Anonymous Rfvujm April 07, 2017 10:33 AM  

Creates cover for refugees? If this is in fact an act of war, as many fake news outlets are calling it, what makes you think Trump will suddenly want to weaken our borders? He knows better than to take in citizens of a country at war with us.

Blogger W.LindsayWheeler April 07, 2017 10:34 AM  

In the military, you are taught that the first sign of a chemical/biological attack is that birds are falling out of the sky, dead birds. Birds are the first to go.

So, my question is---if anyone is worth their salt, "where is the pictures of dead dogs or birds"? Where are the dead animals? Birds and animals are the first to go. They are the first sign of a chem/bio attack. One uses a military bio/chem weapon and it only kills 80 people?

That this occurred within two months of his inauguration?

I don't believe any of this crap. The Saker has it right over at Unz. But, of course, it’s not about us. It’s about Trump. And he, alas, is proving to be the overcooked noodle he has been since, well, pretty much day 1 and ever since: flaccid, confused and spineless. And yeah, he appears be stupid alright, especially so-called “plan” to defeat Daesh

Trump criticized Obama for even thinking of attacking Syria in 2013. Now, Trump does the very opposite of his stated concern earlier. His first premonition is correct. Now, he is off the rails.

And Nikki Haley, this Asian Indian immigrant, is sending us Europeans to war with each other? I live in Bizarro world. Nikki Haley has to go.

Blogger Koanic April 07, 2017 10:35 AM  

> Nikki Haley has to go.

She's already at the UN, where do you want to banish her to, Narnia?

OpenID paworldandtimes April 07, 2017 10:36 AM  

military men tend to push military solutions

I quietly hoped that Trump understood that ther is no political solution, so the purpose of surrounding himself with competent killers such as Mattis was to MAGA by other means.

PA

Blogger B.J. April 07, 2017 10:39 AM  

Did Assad give any statement at all on the gas attack? Did anyone ask him? Something just doesn't add up here.

1 – 200 of 304 Newer› Newest»

Post a Comment

Rules of the blog
Please do not comment as "Anonymous". Comments by "Anonymous" will be spammed.

<< Home

Newer Posts Older Posts